Buffydaddy, I don't claim any medical credentials, just that I am knowledgeable in this issue.
"That by itself is not to imply promiscuity unique to their subculture, but that the sexual morays in a great part of our American culture have changed significantly and crosses cultural borders." The study you referred to was conducted in Sweden and Israel. Both of those would be insular as they are geographically isolated to a degree and it would be a hard case that Israeli women are not culturally insular. That is why the sudy has been discredited.
Yes, I took my definition of "insular" from Websters as well and many cultures are insular. Americans are insular because of the two "great ponds" to our left and right. Blacks are mostly insular from whites within our own borders. Groups with different languages can be insular. It seems that you take great offense at Jews being called insular. Why would that be, because you are Jewish maybe? Is that why you are so defensive and derisive?
"Even in my adult practice I only advocate this to those that are resistant to standard therapies, whose wives can not control their yeast infections because they are passing it back and forth, men with complaints of chronic lacerations of the foreskin from inadequate stretching of the skin, diabetics with genital complications, or in general men who assert that their partners are not so motivated to perform oral sex on a phallus that blossoms forth an aroma somewhere between the stenches of a garbage heap or a jock strap that hasn't been cleaned in six months by an athlete, despite attempts at conventional therapies."
From this statement, I'm assuming you are a urologist. The problems with your statements are evident. It is a simple fact of biology that bacterials, virals and fungals can not discern or discriminate between male and female cells. Therefore, the infections males experience are the same exact infections females experience and are appropriately treated with the exact same medications. These infections are rarely treated with amputative surgery in females but instead are treated successfully with simple medications. Females would be taken aback if you suggested genital amputative surgery to treat these infections but our society has accepted this prescription for males and therefore males unnecessarily accept it.
The lacerations you speak of are simply tearing of the frenulum. The frenulum is stretchable and can be permanently stretched by a simple regimine carried out over a few weeks. I'm surprised I know this and you don't. Are you over selling your knowledge when you put your shingle out? I suspect so. It should be you that is informing here and not me.
If a man has uncontrolled genital odors despite normal cleaning routines, most likely, he is being overly thorough with his hygiene or has been on an antibiotic regimine that has destroyed the normal flora within his foreskin. There is an easy homeopathic cure for this, plain unsweetened yogurt applied daily for several days to re-establish the normal bacterial colonization. It also works for women with odor problems. Why is it again that I'm having to tell YOU these things? Is it some deep seated psyclogical need to circumcise men or is it the lure of the $$$s?
With your education and profession, why is it that you recommend/defend circumcision when a vaccine for HPV has been on the market for 5 years and will make far more difference in the HPV infection rate than male circumcision could ever hope for? How can you assert that circumcision can make a difference when the estimated infection rate is 70% in The US? How can you balance the two when 97% will develop a natural immunity to the infection? Circumcise all for the 3% that will not develop this natural immunity hen the vaccine is available for both males and females? That's poor quality medicine!
RE The ACS site: Apparently, The ACS has taken The Castellegue Study to heart. Among the faults of the study, Castellague only included women who had more than 6 sexaul partners. How could he tell where the infection came from? It was impossible! When it was published in The NEJM, it was accompanied with an editorial refuting it. I suspect The NEJM accepted it for publication simply to keep another journal from publishing it without calling attention to it's numerous methodological problems.
The statement that it is best done at birth and is more effective if done at birth comes from Edgar Schoen, one of the most radical and public circumcision advocates on earth. I have never seen any research to back up the statement and I've seen a lot.
They are absolutely wrong about circumcisied males not developing phimosis. With the "loose" style circumcision that became common in the late 1980's, phimosis has become more common in circumcised children than in intact children. The scar tissue becomes the restrictiing tissue.
Yes, penile cancer is rare as they state. At most, 1:109,000 males and it is imminently treatable if not allowed to go for years. For each of these treatable cancers, approximately 6 infants will die from the circumcision procedure. That is literally killing with prevention especially when there is the HPV vaccine is available.
The ACS says: "This can lead to the build up of secretions, leading to smegma." Well, no. Smegma is the secretion, not leading up to. Smegma is a normal secretion of both the male and female genitals. It was demonized as a carcinogen in the early part of the 20th century but is now known to be a completely bengn substance that has an important function. It "conditions" the mucosal skin of both sexes and acts as a carrier of beneficial enzymes important to the immunological function. It also says it is an "oily secretion." This is absolutely not true. Mucosal skin does not secrete body oils nor sweat. They should know this and I'm astounded that they don't. I once dated a Director of the ACS. I wish I still did and she was still a director. I'd get that information corrected.
It gets even worse! They write: "It hasn't been proven, but some experts are concerned that smegma may also contain compounds that can cause cancer. Some older studies have suggested a link between smegma and penile cancer. Smegma probably doesn't cause penile cancer by itself, but it can cause the penis to become irritated and inflamed, and may make it harder to see very early cancers." It is patently clear that either a woman or circumcised man wrote this. Smegma is completely and totally water soluble and is both quickly and easily rinsed away with just plain water. The risk of penile cancer from smegma is the same as the risk of vulvar cancer from smegma. In fact, the hypothesis that smegma is a carcinogen is from circa 1920 and has long since been disproven. Smegma is an emollient and does not cause irritation or inflamation in either sex nor does it make it harder to see early cancers. Significant accumulations of smegma only develop if a man does not bathe and during the first two to three days after bathing, it is clear. It is suspected that circumcised men also develop smegma but when it is dry, it is clear and they just don't notice it. In men that restore their foreskins even in their 50's or 60's, noticeable smegma is quickly seen after begining restoration indicating that smegma production never ended for them. Just why would it be that smegma would not also be a carcinogen for them?
There are specific types of HPV that cause genital warts, penile cancer and cervical cancer and they are not the same. Incidentally, there are 5 distinct types of penile cancer but only one is associated with HPV infections. Unfortunately, all are lumped together when circumcision advocates try to use this as a justification for circumcison.
I am extremely disappointed that The ACS would have so much false information on their website.
I very well know what the mons pubis is and used it correctly. Are you really a doctor?
I don't post my photo or real information anywhere on the internet. It's a matter of personal security.
I can tell you are running out of amunition. Those who are backed into a corner eventually resort to personal attacks.
Again, the only thing I have said about the Jewish people is that they are insular. That is neither derogatory or defamatory. Most every culture, race or religion is insular to some degree and the insularity sometimes amazes me. I was amazed recently when I dated an Irish woman at the insularity between the Catholics and Protestants in Ireland. I'm Protestant and she was Catholic and was amazed that she would date me when I learned of the insularity. I was also amazed at the insularity between the English and the Irish. There is an insularity between the English, South African whites, New Zealanders and Australians even though they are of the exact same stock and the insularity of all of these groups with Americans and Canadians. Clearly, Jews are among the most insular of these groups as they have a religious difference along with a cultural difference. To try to make anything of this just amplifies that you have run out of arguments.
Comment Reply
Buffydaddy, I don't claim any medical credentials, just that I am knowledgeable in this issue.
"That by itself is not to imply promiscuity unique to their subculture, but that the sexual morays in a great part of our American culture have changed significantly and crosses cultural borders." The study you referred to was conducted in Sweden and Israel. Both of those would be insular as they are geographically isolated to a degree and it would be a hard case that Israeli women are not culturally insular. That is why the sudy has been discredited.
Yes, I took my definition of "insular" from Websters as well and many cultures are insular. Americans are insular because of the two "great ponds" to our left and right. Blacks are mostly insular from whites within our own borders. Groups with different languages can be insular. It seems that you take great offense at Jews being called insular. Why would that be, because you are Jewish maybe? Is that why you are so defensive and derisive?
"Even in my adult practice I only advocate this to those that are resistant to standard therapies, whose wives can not control their yeast infections because they are passing it back and forth, men with complaints of chronic lacerations of the foreskin from inadequate stretching of the skin, diabetics with genital complications, or in general men who assert that their partners are not so motivated to perform oral sex on a phallus that blossoms forth an aroma somewhere between the stenches of a garbage heap or a jock strap that hasn't been cleaned in six months by an athlete, despite attempts at conventional therapies."
From this statement, I'm assuming you are a urologist. The problems with your statements are evident. It is a simple fact of biology that bacterials, virals and fungals can not discern or discriminate between male and female cells. Therefore, the infections males experience are the same exact infections females experience and are appropriately treated with the exact same medications. These infections are rarely treated with amputative surgery in females but instead are treated successfully with simple medications. Females would be taken aback if you suggested genital amputative surgery to treat these infections but our society has accepted this prescription for males and therefore males unnecessarily accept it.
The lacerations you speak of are simply tearing of the frenulum. The frenulum is stretchable and can be permanently stretched by a simple regimine carried out over a few weeks. I'm surprised I know this and you don't. Are you over selling your knowledge when you put your shingle out? I suspect so. It should be you that is informing here and not me.
If a man has uncontrolled genital odors despite normal cleaning routines, most likely, he is being overly thorough with his hygiene or has been on an antibiotic regimine that has destroyed the normal flora within his foreskin. There is an easy homeopathic cure for this, plain unsweetened yogurt applied daily for several days to re-establish the normal bacterial colonization. It also works for women with odor problems. Why is it again that I'm having to tell YOU these things? Is it some deep seated psyclogical need to circumcise men or is it the lure of the $$$s?
With your education and profession, why is it that you recommend/defend circumcision when a vaccine for HPV has been on the market for 5 years and will make far more difference in the HPV infection rate than male circumcision could ever hope for? How can you assert that circumcision can make a difference when the estimated infection rate is 70% in The US? How can you balance the two when 97% will develop a natural immunity to the infection? Circumcise all for the 3% that will not develop this natural immunity hen the vaccine is available for both males and females? That's poor quality medicine!
RE The ACS site: Apparently, The ACS has taken The Castellegue Study to heart. Among the faults of the study, Castellague only included women who had more than 6 sexaul partners. How could he tell where the infection came from? It was impossible! When it was published in The NEJM, it was accompanied with an editorial refuting it. I suspect The NEJM accepted it for publication simply to keep another journal from publishing it without calling attention to it's numerous methodological problems.
The statement that it is best done at birth and is more effective if done at birth comes from Edgar Schoen, one of the most radical and public circumcision advocates on earth. I have never seen any research to back up the statement and I've seen a lot.
They are absolutely wrong about circumcisied males not developing phimosis. With the "loose" style circumcision that became common in the late 1980's, phimosis has become more common in circumcised children than in intact children. The scar tissue becomes the restrictiing tissue.
Yes, penile cancer is rare as they state. At most, 1:109,000 males and it is imminently treatable if not allowed to go for years. For each of these treatable cancers, approximately 6 infants will die from the circumcision procedure. That is literally killing with prevention especially when there is the HPV vaccine is available.
The ACS says: "This can lead to the build up of secretions, leading to smegma." Well, no. Smegma is the secretion, not leading up to. Smegma is a normal secretion of both the male and female genitals. It was demonized as a carcinogen in the early part of the 20th century but is now known to be a completely bengn substance that has an important function. It "conditions" the mucosal skin of both sexes and acts as a carrier of beneficial enzymes important to the immunological function. It also says it is an "oily secretion." This is absolutely not true. Mucosal skin does not secrete body oils nor sweat. They should know this and I'm astounded that they don't. I once dated a Director of the ACS. I wish I still did and she was still a director. I'd get that information corrected.
It gets even worse! They write: "It hasn't been proven, but some experts are concerned that smegma may also contain compounds that can cause cancer. Some older studies have suggested a link between smegma and penile cancer. Smegma probably doesn't cause penile cancer by itself, but it can cause the penis to become irritated and inflamed, and may make it harder to see very early cancers." It is patently clear that either a woman or circumcised man wrote this. Smegma is completely and totally water soluble and is both quickly and easily rinsed away with just plain water. The risk of penile cancer from smegma is the same as the risk of vulvar cancer from smegma. In fact, the hypothesis that smegma is a carcinogen is from circa 1920 and has long since been disproven. Smegma is an emollient and does not cause irritation or inflamation in either sex nor does it make it harder to see early cancers. Significant accumulations of smegma only develop if a man does not bathe and during the first two to three days after bathing, it is clear. It is suspected that circumcised men also develop smegma but when it is dry, it is clear and they just don't notice it. In men that restore their foreskins even in their 50's or 60's, noticeable smegma is quickly seen after begining restoration indicating that smegma production never ended for them. Just why would it be that smegma would not also be a carcinogen for them?
There are specific types of HPV that cause genital warts, penile cancer and cervical cancer and they are not the same. Incidentally, there are 5 distinct types of penile cancer but only one is associated with HPV infections. Unfortunately, all are lumped together when circumcision advocates try to use this as a justification for circumcison.
I am extremely disappointed that The ACS would have so much false information on their website.
I very well know what the mons pubis is and used it correctly. Are you really a doctor?
I don't post my photo or real information anywhere on the internet. It's a matter of personal security.
I can tell you are running out of amunition. Those who are backed into a corner eventually resort to personal attacks.
Again, the only thing I have said about the Jewish people is that they are insular. That is neither derogatory or defamatory. Most every culture, race or religion is insular to some degree and the insularity sometimes amazes me. I was amazed recently when I dated an Irish woman at the insularity between the Catholics and Protestants in Ireland. I'm Protestant and she was Catholic and was amazed that she would date me when I learned of the insularity. I was also amazed at the insularity between the English and the Irish. There is an insularity between the English, South African whites, New Zealanders and Australians even though they are of the exact same stock and the insularity of all of these groups with Americans and Canadians. Clearly, Jews are among the most insular of these groups as they have a religious difference along with a cultural difference. To try to make anything of this just amplifies that you have run out of arguments.
Frank O'Hara
March 20, 2010 - 9:29amThis Comment
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